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bobblejot

Bondtech Style Extruder

by bobblejot Jul 23, 2018
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What an parts i need print if i want use it for direct extruder?
Can you tell me?

Hello, work with CR10S ?

Hi i think all the Creality machines have a similar extruder mounting so it should work, I don't have a CR10S so can't check unless Creality have also released it's CAD files. You could always do a quick print of the base and test it in position to see.

Thank you !

I have a doubt about the fixing on the motor support..

In the description, there is a link that does not work -> Bondtech Clone 1.75mm Gears

WHere buy this please -> http://prntscr.com/lparur

No problem, link should be working again my fault :-)

Good design easier to print than the others here. would you like to add a version with m10 pushfittings. I allread have lots of them. So i would be happy to use them.

Wil see what i can do, what length of thread do the M10 fittings have i don't have any to check? or better do you have a part number for your specific fittings?

thanks for your effort. They are usaly used on several extruders its 8 mm length m10x1 thread.

EDIT: MAybe you share the steps and i can do it on my own and share it here with others

Will try and find some time over the weekend to get a new version up, I do have plans to share the Step and F3D files for everything i have done for free on my personal site, Just trying to get everything finished and to a point i am happy with Got 10 3d printer designs a couple of CNC designs and about another 40 or 50 parts that i'm trying to finish off but the usual life and work keep getting in the way :-)

Yeah, i know your pain of unfinished/semifinished models. If the fusion is clean of triangles, it easy to add a modeled thread on both sides. Just a few clicks....

Always model everything from scratch these days, got tired of trying to re-work things to suit my needs. Sometimes can take longer but makes life easier in the end. My only problem i haven't always been as careful about my organisation over the years so now i am trying to get everything into a state i'm happy with and then i get distracted with something else and before you know it it's Christmas again :-)

I agree. Before i start modeling my own extruder cause of missing m10 threads i want to ask you. As ive said theese are a few clicks in an existing model. Modeling an own extruder will take a lot of iteration till all fits and works well. Thanks for your patience and effort :D

i see it thanks :D

No problem. Let me know if it actually works :-)

After some month of printing i want to report back. The extruder works great and pushed more than 10kg on two printers. Meanwhile i have 3 of this extruders. With slightly modification it could be printed without support. The support is only needed at the part which have to take the arm in. Thanks for it. Maybe you can consider that modification to have it print without support. Without the steps i cant make it work. Thanks for this design.

i addedtwo pics how i did it. The screw holes need a champfer,the fusion meshimport makes em impossible for me. At least i wasent smart enough to manage it ;)

Hi!
Nice design!
Please, could you add an version for M10 push-in fitting?

M10 threaded PTC version added as well as 1/4", Not printed myself yet so i hope they are Ok.

Nice design dude, I just started printing a third one of these!
Only thing i would have changed in a future revision is the radius/size of the recess for the bowden fitting and tension screw on the base part , I've had to file down the lid a little to make a good flush fit for the two parts. Not much needed but maybe just offcenter the recess by 0.2 mm or something.

Hi thanks, took me a while to get the actual gears but i have now done a modified version with better filament path and a few other tweaks just because the cloned gears are dimensionally different to the originals, who would have thought :-)

Will get the modified files up shortly.

Yeah i'm waiting for the china gears myself, how far off are they btw? So bad that it have to be addressed?

Each gear was 0.2mm smaller than the originals ( the ones i received anyway ) so have modified the extruder to suit plus should still work for the fine for the originals as well.

Ah ok! Could you maybe put up the gear measurements for reference?

v3 files are now uploaded. The original Bondtech gears were 8.2mm in Dia. and the clones i received were 8.0mm in Dia.

Nice! Scraping the ones i made and printing the v3 instead lol. Tried to re-use the push in fittings btw? Like just snip or slice up the old lid and extract them?

i just use a pair of snips and carefully cut the sides.

Hi not sure if it is of mine or not but the original design from Bondtech is free to use and i think this may be from the original.

This is great! I test and works. I have to push the fittings with a hammer. The 20mm screw is short or spring is long, it should be a shorter spring or long screw :) This inverted the extruder direction, need to change on firmware.

hmm not had an issue with the screw length you do have to push a bit to start the thread but once started provides enough tension i find. The fittings i find i can push them in just by placing them in the hole then pressing against a flat surface like a table top.

Your right about the direction i should probably mention that in the description.

I have printed into ABS maybe thats why i need a hammer.
And maybe i use a very strong spring, because i don't have force to put screw reaching the nut, my solution: Cut 3 turns of the spring.
I also find that i have to full screw the tension screw, before i gave it a margin but it result in underextruding at a point i can see the filament at middle path of the PTFE but anyway i love this mod, looks much more solid than stock, i fell i can print a bit faster without tick the extruder

That will be my fault i printed the first one in abs then had to wait for the gears and ended up printing the rest in PETG so never used or tried the ABS one, the tolerances probably would be tighter.

When i upload the new version you can try it in PETG to see if it is better, i am using 2 of them at the moment on my ender 3's finding them to be a lot more reliable than the original creality extruders.

I used your v2 base. They are ok and working.
What are the differences for the new version?

Some results

My ender 3: Volcano + 0.8mm nozzle, print at 0.2mm layer height

Pink: Before this extruder mod
Green: With bondtech mod
Orange: Prusa MK3 stock 0.4mm nozzle 0.2mm layer

From pink to green i notice a very good improvement.
Orange is far best of course but is a 0.4mm nozzle and a superior machine

Pretty good results, still i think i need to dial better some settings

Definitely looks more consistent what print settings are you using? For a 0.8 nozzle at 0.2 layers it's pretty good not sure i would go that low with a 0.8 nozzle though? what does make a difference on these machines is doing a proper PID tune of the heatbed, honestly makes a world of difference to print quality.

I use my own made profile for Slic3r, you can see them here: https://github.com/sn4k3/Ender3
Well you can go low as 0.10 with any nozzle, even 0.8mm nozzle you can go like 0.08mm. But i should exchange for 0.6mm nozzle since i have one on my MK3 and i love that ratio you can go from 0.6mm extrusion to 1.2mm and print only 1 perimeter to speed up things, its amazing. While 0.8mm nozzle goes from 0.8mm to 1.7mm extrusion line
I'm printing a Owl with 0.3mm layer to compare with MK3, will post latter :)
Why heatbad PID make this diference since it only affect first layer? I done PID to hotend while fans on at max speed
I also did a ton of mods, tring to put ender3 like prusa mk3 in terms of quality

Just my preference i normally use a 0.6 nozzle for everything. On heated beds like the Ender 3's if the bed isn't tuned properly or is using bang bang control you can see issues that some might say is Z banding. Thin beds when trying to control at temp. do expand and contract very slightly it's not normally an issue if you have heavier beds or using glass but the thin PCB beds can be quite noticeable. I could actually force it quite easily on my first Ender just by enabling bang bang instead of PID control and the print quality difference was easily noticeable.

Ok how can i activate bang bang? Or better to do the PID tune? I'm using glass on top

Don't use bang bang PID control is better but it should always be tuned for your machine the same with your hotend, There's good information on the Marlin Firmware site on how to go about doing it.

I tune hotend pid by run code at terminal and get the K, i do that while fans are on. For bed i do the same thing? just run via terminal?

Yep that's right :-)

Owl: Very good results! I'm amazed how good it turn.
The only problem now is the retraction, is clear one side is better than other, where it resume the retraction we can spot missing dots. What settings are you running for retraction?

You can download my S3D profile from my website ( it's not quite finished yet :-) ), but i use 5mm for retract and 4 for wipe.

Thank you, i can give that settings a try. What is the Coast at end? Never understood what it really does since Slic3r dont have that.
Do you have stock, v6 or volcano hotend?

Those settings were just for the stock hotend with 0.4 nozzle, Coast basically stops extruding the specified amount before the end of a travel move while wipe is retracting while moving the specified amount at the end of a travel move.

Thank you :)
I also find this usefull article: http://lokspace.eu/a-solution-to-your-bowden-issues/
Helping alot!

After follow the article and double jerk and accels my prints look even better. Here are some mini prints both printed at 0.2mm layer height.
I still need to find what is causing that tiny holes and missing line.

What material is it? and what speed are you printing at?

PLA, 45mm/s for perimeters

This looks awesome. How does it perform? I've got the gears ready

No idea :-) Ordered the gears and designed this and then there was an issue with my shipment and long story short i am still waiting! that's the reason it's still a work in progress but i do know others are using it and so should just work like a standard bondtech i hope?

where to get the non printed parts ?

Hi there is a list of materials on the details page :-)

Hi,
Very nice design!
Thanks!

Later edit:
Looks like I need better glasses :D

No problem just wish thingiverse would let you re-arrange the custom sections, suppose i could just copy and paste them higher. Anyway glad you found them :-)